2008 Election Talk

[matilda]

Don't apologise darl, they're all good.

Nail biting OR WHAT?

I really can't remember being this nervous about an election except the Federal one here last year - that too was all about who and what we are I suppose.

Mmmmmm

M

[mlm828]

It's almost here -- finally! Election Day is tomorrow!

First things first. To our members in the U.S.: VOTE! (No excuses accepted).

Then, after you've voted, please share your experience here. How was the turnout in your area? Were the lines long? What was the mood of the voters? Were there any problems?

[Eyphur]

Nov 3, 2008 20:59:44 GMT -5 mlm828 said:

Then, after you've voted, please share your experience here. How was the turnout in your area? Were the lines long? What was the mood of the voters? Were there any problems?

I stopped on my way to work to vote. I live in a rural area and vote at the local fire hall. There are 4 electronic voting machines. Usually there is a short line of 3-4 people ahead of me when I go to vote. Today I was in a hurry (because I had to be at work at 1:00) and there were about 7 people in line. So I waited and slowly made my way to the front of the line and when I get up there and the poll worker is checking my ID, another poll worker says to the people in line behind me "Does anybody want a paper ballot?" I was a little peeved because if I could have just gotten a paper ballot the minute I walked in the door. I would have been out sooner and less worried about being late.

[mlm828]

Just back from voting. I deliberately chose to vote at an off-peak time (11 a.m.), and it was a breeze. All the voting booths were occupied at my polling place, but there was no line, and no wait. The only obstacle to voting was the puddle in front of the entrance to the polling place (left over from the rain shower that passed through our area at about 8 this morning).

[Chris]

Good luck!!!!!

I have utterly enjoyed reading your posts in this thread and I think I may have to karma you all. Might take me a while but you have made this election so much more interesting for me (as if it wasn't interesting enough already )

Thanks you, mob, for a great debate, and please..... GO VOTE!!!!!

Take care and keep smiling
- Chris

[hoosier]

I took advantage of Indiana's early voting since I had a training session at work today and wouldn't be getting out until 7PM. Went in and showed my ID (which is no big deal no matter what some people say) and had the choice of either paper or touch screen. I went with paper (that fill in the little dot business) and was in and out. I was #743 to vote here. They are counting ballots now since the polls closed at 6PM so we should know pretty soon I should think.

[inuvik]

I'm just wondering if all the political upheaval here in Canada has been making the news anywhere else?

Parliament has been sitting for about a week now since our election in October. It was a minority Conservative government. Yesterday, the Liberals and NDP, supported by the Bloc Quebecois (the separatists!), announced a formal coalition to overthrow the government. They have signed documents, allocated Cabinet positions, and have everything laid out. On Monday, when the budget is tabled, they plan to vote against it. Then they will go to the Governor General and ask her to dissolve Parliament and give power to them.

The government has a few options, including asking the GG to prorogue (sp?) Parliament and reconvene later. The GG cannot refuse that request if asked, it is just a formality.

Anyway, no matter what happens, this is historic. Minority governments have fallen before. But there has never been an organized opposition coalition like this.

The radio stations, tv stations, papers, etc--nothing else is being talked about. Even shows that aren't talk radio are fielding calls! It really is exciting.

My feeling is we just had an election and the people have spoken. That must be respected no matter what people's politics are. It's been a week--far too soon for this to happen.

News story: Governor General Rushes Home to Deal with Political Turmoil (she's in Europe):

www.cbc.ca/canada/story/2008/12/02/gg-return.html

[hoosier]

I can't say I've heard of this. I miss the news and usually don't have time to read the newspaper--unless I'm indexing one and being in the 1800's I'm a little out of touch. It doesn't seem right to have a fall-out so soon. I know about Quebec's wanting independence but do they really think they can go it alone? How do they think they will survive in the world market etc.? Look at Palestine for example.

[inuvik]

Dec 2, 2008 19:49:36 GMT -5 hoosier said:

I can't say I've heard of this. I miss the news and usually don't have time to read the newspaper--unless I'm indexing one and being in the 1800's I'm a little out of touch. It doesn't seem right to have a fall-out so soon. I know about Quebec's wanting independence but do they really think they can go it alone? How do they think they will survive in the world market etc.? Look at Palestine for example.

The news said today that the BQ will get to appoint 6 senators in the deal. I knew there had to be a reason!

I am amazed at the reaction to all this. The complacency here is gone. There are tons of online petitions (for both sides) out there, as well as rallies in all the major cities planned for this weekend. Wow!

Looks like when the GG gets back today, Harper will ask for her to suspend Parliament until the end of Jan. Gee, is there anything going on in the economy right now so we want to have a Parliament sitting? Good grief.

According to the polls, the country is as divided as Parliament about having the coalition or not.

The PM is going to address the nation tonight on TV, and I have to miss it (Christmas party, and I'm not even going to be going home to record it!) The coalition wants equal TV time to respond.

The one thing the polls show we all agree upon is no one wants another election, only 6 weeks after the last one.

Thanks for letting me go on about this!

www.cbc.ca/canada/story/2008/12/03/jean-crisis.html

[hoosier]

No problem. The thought of having to go through another election so soon makes me shudder. Hopefully they can come up with some compromise but if not you have my sympathy.

[inuvik]

The Governor General has just suspended Parliament.


Gov. Gen. Michaëlle Jean has granted a request from Stephen Harper to suspend Parliament, the Prime Minister's Office told CBC News, a move that avoids a confidence vote set for Monday that could have toppled his minority government.

The announcement on Thursday comes after a two-hour meeting with Jean at Rideau Hall in which Harper asked her to prorogue, or suspend, the current parliamentary session until the end of January, when the Tories plan to table a budget.

A no-confidence vote could have precipitated the rise of a Liberal-NDP coalition. If the Governor General had refused the prime minister's request, she could have called an election had the Conservatives lost the no-confidence vote. Or she could have allowed the proposed Liberal-NDP coalition to govern if the no-confidence vote was successful.

But the decision to suspend Parliament only gives the Tories a reprieve until late January, when they plan to table a budget that could set them up for a no-confidence vote.

Harper waved to onlookers after his limousine arrived at Rideau Hall at 9:30 a.m ET Thursday. He was greeted by about 40 chanting supporters, including Conservative staffers. A single anti-Harper demonstrator stood waving a sign reading "Harper Must Go."

Harper has pledged to use "every legal means" to prevent a Liberal-NDP coalition government, backed by the Bloc Québécois, from taking power.

Making his case

Harper's visit comes a day after he took to the airwaves to make his case that his government should remain in power.

In a five-minute, pre-recorded statement Wednesday night, Harper spoke bluntly against a proposed Liberal-NDP coalition backed by "separatists," saying the federal government must stand unequivocally for keeping the country together in the face of the global economic crisis.

Jean returned to Ottawa on Wednesday after cutting short a two-week trip to Europe.

Liberal Leader Stéphane Dion, who would head the proposed coalition, said he sent a letter to Jean on Wednesday, urging her to reject any attempt by Harper to prorogue Parliament.

Dion responded to Harper's address with his own taped rebuttal in which he defended the notion of a proposed coalition government "as normal and current practice in many parts of the world."

The Conservatives have lost the confidence of the majority of members of the House of Commons — largely because of their, in the opposition's view, inadequate reaction to Canada's financial crunch — and thus, "have lost the right to govern," Dion said.

Economic statement lambasted

The coalition sprang up after the Tories released an economic statement that was lambasted by the opposition parties.

They accused Harper of doing nothing to address the current economic crisis and slammed what they saw as ideologically driven measures such as the proposed elimination of subsidies for political parties, a three-year ban on the right of civil servants to strike and limits on the ability of women to sue for pay equity.

Harper has since backed down on those contentious issues, but the opposition has pushed forward with the coalition.

The coalition — which would have a 24-member cabinet composed of six NDP and 18 Liberal MPs — has vowed to make an economic stimulus package a priority, proposing a multibillion-dollar plan that would include help for the auto and forestry sectors.

With 77 Liberal MPs and 37 New Democrats, plus the support of 49 Bloc members, the three parties have more seats than the 143 held by the Tories.

With files from the Canadian Press

[matilda]

So innie, what's the general view, or is it really divided, on the role of the GG?

Last time a GG dismissed a Government here has had ramifications for the longest time and indeed WHEN we become a republic (refuse to say IF anymore, can you believe we still have the British monarch) I think it will be because the GG dismissed a democratically elected Government - regardless of whether you think it was the right thing to do or not, the fact remains that a representative of the British Queen (for pity's sake) can and could still do that.

You poor things, all those constitutional questions abounding on top of the action itself.

Interesting the Liberals and the NDP in coalition with Bloc Quebecois, strange days indeed.

My sister, her husband and their kids (he's one of yours) about to go over for xmas - interesting for them!

Matilda

[inuvik]

Dec 6, 2008 21:12:52 GMT -5 matilda said:

So innie, what's the general view, or is it really divided, on the role of the GG?

Nobody is really talking about the parliamentary structure and role of the GG--just about the crisis itself.

For that, I don't think there is a general view--once again, regionalism is rearing its ugly head.

Atlantic Canada and Ontario, I believe, were more in favour of the coalition, and I would assume Quebec is too, based on the Bloc, but I haven't heard.

Alberta was definitely in favour of Harper (Alberta is strongly Conservative, only one MP that is not Conservative, and that person is the first one in many, many elections! Harper is also from Alberta) and proroguing, and I believe most of the West was too. What a mess though!

But of course, there are individuals everywhere that don't fit the majority, but that's what the polls say.

Dec 6, 2008 21:12:52 GMT -5 matilda said:

Last time a GG dismissed a Government here has had ramifications for the longest time and indeed WHEN we become a republic (refuse to say IF anymore, can you believe we still have the British monarch) I think it will be because the GG dismissed a democratically elected Government - regardless of whether you think it was the right thing to do or not, the fact remains that a representative of the British Queen (for pity's sake) can and could still do that.

When was this? I didn't know that.

The thing is, here the GG basically has to grant the request when asked. The PM appoints her and is her boss, so kind of hard to say no--also, I think there is no precedent to say no.

You'll have to let us know what your sister's family thinks! Be interesting to hear their view.

[mlm828]

From what I've read, this is a huge controversy in Canada, and the country is sharply divided. From south of the border, it looks like a desperate attempt by Harper to keep power. As I understand it, the Harper government has been a minority government all along, so he didn't exactly have a mandate. Then he reportedly didn't do what he said in the campaign he was going to do regarding the economy.

Is the Canadian economy in as much trouble as the U.S. economy? How is the economy in Australia?

I bet the Bush/Cheney/Rove cabal is simply salivating over the idea of suspending the legislature to hold onto power. Thank heavens they don't have the ability to do that! On the other hand, if the U.S. had a parliamentary system, we would have been spared the last two years of the Bush/Cheney/Rove gang, because the Democrats gained control of Congress in 2006.

[matilda]

It was 1975 innie. Ugly.

Sister left today - LA tonight, then off to Toronto next day so I'm sure she'll be sharing her observations with me by Thursday night your time at the very latest. Needless to say we are a very opinionated family.

mlm the economy is sh... here - not quite AS bad as the US I don't think, interventionist action (lending guarantees, infrastructure investment - noticed on weekend that new President has similiar plans) earlier rather than later but we're all interdependent eh?

Biggest regional bank laying off last week and this - gonna be a hard/different xmas I reckon. People, including us, being VERY cautious.

A bright spot - Secretary of State-elect Clinton. WOOHOO. Come to think of it I may just slip on over to Margaret and Helen for their take.

Cheers

M